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Author Topic: littleguys ideas  (Read 2305 times)
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littleguy301
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« Reply #15 on: February 13, 2018, 12:33:33 AM »

Little Guy,

I like a lot of your ideas.

1.  Starting after thanksgiving would be awesome.  Let the kids enjoy the time off, holiday and the food.
2.  14 events is a lot.  I like the idea of 5 tournaments and 9 duals.  Multi duals on a school night would be awesome but I don't think many coaches would give up a tournament for a multi-dual.
3.  Regionals and sectionals needed to be combined into one.  Then take the top 4-8 teams and wrestle them the following weekend to see who goes to team state.
4.  If you want to have a conference tournament keep doing it or take the week off.  No different than any other tournament.
5.  Make it into 3 equal divisions for teams and have the regionals and sectionals combined for a 16 man seeded bracket, you lose your first match you are done and you can't get a wrestle back for second unless you make the semis.  That should solve the 5 match rule.  Plus even amount of teams in each division plus or minus 1 team.  8 sectionals and you qualify 16 kids to state per weight.  More kids qualifying for state but you still have to place top 2 out of roughly 15 teams.
6.  Make girls wrestling a varsity sport.


I like your ideas also.

number 2,,,,we are on the same page but different paragraphs. I am not looking at giving up tournaments by any means.

example: I will use our conference. instead of driving 2 hours round trip for a thursday night dual, why not make it a tri dual instead and get another conference team there. Start the dual at 5:30 instead and have 2 meets in a night. saves on travel and probably gets more fans in the stands and might counter the "sick" wrestler knowing he will get 2 matches in, instead of 1 rear end kicking.

in order for that to happen we have to get away from the 7 and 7.

in this day and age, saving travel for a 45 minute dual on a cold january night where weather is an issue, maybe have a tri meet and get 2 duals in. then as coaches you have the freedom of maybe a week off here and there to work into your schedule of training for the kids or simply give a friday night off or what ever night you would like.
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littleguy301
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« Reply #16 on: February 13, 2018, 12:36:27 AM »

I still cannt get over the idea of the WIAA preaches it is for the kids but yet when kids or teams make state they are only guarenteed 1 match? this goes for all sports outside football. teams and athletes make state they should be able to have 2 matches and teams should be able to wrestle at least for 3rd place, 5th in D1.

so please WIAA dont tell me it is about the kids and such when clearly a huge over look in part not to be wrestling for 3rd and 5th as a team and getting those kids a chance at 2 matches. every other tournament does it during the year but sectionals and state.
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littleguy301
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« Reply #17 on: February 13, 2018, 12:45:23 AM »

And Jamie if they laugh when you tell them we are coming please remind them

They laughed when I said I was gonna whip Trevor Spencer

They laughed when I said I was gonna be an NCAA Champion

They laughed when I said I was gonna be an Olympian

They laughed when I said I was going to be great at MMA

You think by now people would get the idea.  We are not stopping until we get to the top, mark my words.

ben, I seriously doubt anyone is laughing at what your doing with the awa. actually I think it is quite opposite of that. your club name is being brought up whether it is you on social media or the results you have been getting.

I think many cheered that you were going to wrestle trevor spencer
I think many pulled for you to win every finals match you were in at the ncaa!
I think many were pretty excited that you were going to make an olympic run and did support you on that
I think many tuned in MMA because YOU were in it and made a heck of a name for your self.

finally, I think many are supporting you in your quest to have the top club in the country. Your enrollment is up and your getting top notch studs in your room(s) where ever your putting up new places!

to end all, I tried to start a topic as to how we need to improve high school wrestling overall. your club is helping for sure along with all the other clubs. Though we also need some changes overall to help wrestling thrive in todays world!
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dforsythe
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« Reply #18 on: February 13, 2018, 07:38:53 AM »

While the multi-duals instead of duals during the week might make that night better, it takes away your home dual opportunities. Right now with 7 duals I only have 3-4 home matches a season. I need those home matches to show the people in our community what wrestling is all about. If that fell to 1-2 home events because we were doing multi-duals, I would have trouble getting people to experience wrestling. Many of the other ideas are great. I especially like starting after Thanksgiving and combining regionals for D2 and D3.
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shouldvewrestled
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« Reply #19 on: February 13, 2018, 07:58:04 AM »

While the multi-duals instead of duals during the week might make that night better, it takes away your home dual opportunities. Right now with 7 duals I only have 3-4 home matches a season. I need those home matches to show the people in our community what wrestling is all about. If that fell to 1-2 home events because we were doing multi-duals, I would have trouble getting people to experience wrestling. Many of the other ideas are great. I especially like starting after Thanksgiving and combining regionals for D2 and D3.
Without an event max number and just match count, you could schedule other tris or quads with non-conference similar quality teams and still have your 3-4 home events.
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« Reply #19 on: February 13, 2018, 07:58:04 AM »

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wrastle63
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« Reply #20 on: February 13, 2018, 07:58:48 AM »

Littleguy, I am willing to put money on it that in a few years you will see WI wrestling thriving nationally. Not being a homer but Ben and AWA is transforming the landscape of WI wrestling for the better as a whole. Not to mention Jordy at Crass Trained is doing phenomenal things further up north. It may be pertinent to have those two gentleman get with the WIAA and see if any changes can be implemented.

not saying wisconsin will not be on the national level. I was directing my comments mainly toward what is happening on the high school level as concerns to what would make high school wrestling in wisconsin alittle bit better.

while I respect and admire what crass and awa has to offer and what they are doing, they probably will not have the ear of Dave Anderson or Wade Labecki. It is more the coach of any high school team that will have the ears of the WIAA.
Ben and AWA are far and away the best club in Wisconsin. They have multiple locations so they are meeting with more kids. They also are doing something no other club in the state is doing and that is helping people hundreds of miles away. You donít see Crass doing technique videos, and donít see Advance talking and doing Mental Mondays. High school coaches can have a bigger impact that a club coach because they have 5 practices a week whereas a club coach has a couple, but AWA is helping the whole state not just there 45 mile radius.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2018, 11:59:24 AM by wrastle63 » Logged
3wrestle
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« Reply #21 on: February 13, 2018, 08:26:23 AM »

Littleguy, I am willing to put money on it that in a few years you will see WI wrestling thriving nationally. Not being a homer but Ben and AWA is transforming the landscape of WI wrestling for the better as a whole. Not to mention Jordy at Crass Trained is doing phenomenal things further up north. It may be pertinent to have those two gentleman get with the WIAA and see if any changes can be implemented.

not saying wisconsin will not be on the national level. I was directing my comments mainly toward what is happening on the high school level as concerns to what would make high school wrestling in wisconsin alittle bit better.

while I respect and admire what crass and awa has to offer and what they are doing, they probably will not have the ear of Dave Anderson or Wade Labecki. It is more the coach of any high school team that will have the ears of the WIAA.
Ben and AWA are far and away the best club in Wisconsin. They have multiple locations so they are meeting with more kids. They also are doing something no other club in the state is doing and that is helping people hundreds of miles away. You donít see Crass doing technique, and donít see Advance talking and doing Mental Mondays. High school coaches can have a bigger impact that a club coach because they have 5 practices a week whereas a club coach has a couple, but AWA is helping the whole state not just there 45 mile radius.




I donít believe this was started to be about whoís club is the best! Little guy was giving ideas about how to improve High School Wrestling during the folkstyle season.
I personally like the idea of event or match count let the coaches decide whatís best for their team

Of course every parent thinks the club they support is the best otherwise we wouldnít be paying the fees for our children to attend that club.
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maggie
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« Reply #22 on: February 13, 2018, 08:34:48 AM »

great ideas LG  Wink
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« Reply #23 on: February 13, 2018, 08:46:28 AM »

1) Do not take away the home duals, if anything figure out a way to increase home meets, rotate invites/tourneys, somehow increase local participation to as many areas as possible.
2) Increase Co-op, or accept the fact that some schools are probably never going to be wrestling schools. If lackluster duals/forfeits are truly a large reason for declining enrollment (I don't believe it is, but many do), then eliminate the bottom.  Sorry.
3) But first-have a full assault marketing plan from WIAA or whomever, with buy-in from local level.  Traveling clinics, ad's, facebook/instagram, etc.  Get the youth excited or at least in the know about the sport.  Think Play60 by football.  Has this ever been done?
4) Encourage coaches to get team managers, parents, etc. to facebook live matches, to be active on Facebook/instagram, post interviews with kids after the matches, etc. to promote at the local level.  Seats in the bleachers get the attention of AD's.  Get every team to have that "team mom" that is that rabid scheduler/connector that rallies other parents or team members to do the extra things.  Wrestling while a team sport, but continues with the indiividual mentality.  
5)  Increase the connection between the local youth clubs and schools.  I remember how psyched my 4th/5th grader was that the HS kid that came to help at a couple practices.  Little things like that can stick with a kid.  
6) Get rid of the weight allowance.  Encourages cutting, confusing to the average viewer, and increases the gap between the average wreslter that doesn't want to cut, and the stud wrestler that comes down this time of year.
7)  For the love of all that is good in this world, do NOT cut weight classes.  No way that cutting opportunity across the board will increase participation across the board.  If it is a regional or school specific or division specific issue, address it at that level.
Cool  Everytime a local newspaper prints an article about wrestling, call and thank them, give it a thumbs up on their facebook, or write a comment on-line.  If not happening, get a group of 5+ from every local school to call and ask them to, invite them to a dual.
9)  At the local level, get  Div II/III colleges with wrestling programs out a bit more. Will help both recruitment to HS and colleges.

Overall I would recommend more of a marketing then process approach first.  Does the average parent know that one of the better Div I conferences in the NCAA is the Ivy League/EIWA?  That Princeton/Cornell had one of the beeter recruiting classes in coillege? Wrestling has changed.
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« Reply #24 on: February 13, 2018, 09:10:55 AM »

What cuts more opportunities than anything?  Forcing teams to co-op and thus losing a program forever.  Very few kids travel to another school to practice and wrestle as part of a co-op.  Every co-op leads to lost opportunities in my mind.

What cuts home events more than anything?  Co-ops.  One or the other is going to have no home event or fewer home events of they share.

What cuts marketing more than anything?  Co-ops.  Nobody is going to be excited to market a program where the kids has to travel 15 miles after school to practice.

In my mind cutting the number of weight classes does not eliminate any opportunities to wrestle for the home school.

Duals are the key to building teams.  Basketball has a team of 7 or 8 players that actually play.  As crazy as it sounds I think wrestling might even be better off if it had something crazy like 7 weight classes for varsity and JV for duals.  Heck we might even have JV2 duals.  Instead of 14 weight classes in one team have two teams of 7 with different weight classes with lighter ones for the younger guys.  In reality I think 10 weight classes probably works best for including as many as possible with distribution of weight classes.  I would still keep the 14 weight classes for all individual tournaments.  Create two wrestling divisions not based on enrollment but based on actual guys fat tested.  Top division can have 14 weight classes.  2nd division can use 10 weight classes.  One size does not fit all.

Absolutely need to get rid of the growth allowance. 132 is 132 for every weigh in whether it is later in the season, a consecutive day of wrestling, after a snow day, etc.  The weight class should not change at any weigh-in.  Out of curiosity does college give any extra pounds over course of the season?
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« Reply #24 on: February 13, 2018, 09:10:55 AM »

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dforsythe
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« Reply #25 on: February 13, 2018, 09:27:14 AM »

Sorry Doc, but I have to disagree about coops. Our experience between North Fond du Lac and St. Mary's Springs has been very positive. The Springs program was non-existent for over 10 years when we started the coop. For the first few years, we only had 2-4 kids from Springs. We are now up to 8 and they make up a little over a third of our team. We now can fill all 14 weight classes and have become a competitive team. Due to the success we have seen, our numbers are continuing to grow and the popularity of wrestling seems to be growing at both schools. I would say that we have successfully resurrected a program that was dead for over 10 years that at one time had been very successful.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2018, 09:32:45 AM by dforsythe » Logged
wrastle63
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« Reply #26 on: February 13, 2018, 09:30:32 AM »

Littleguy, I am willing to put money on it that in a few years you will see WI wrestling thriving nationally. Not being a homer but Ben and AWA is transforming the landscape of WI wrestling for the better as a whole. Not to mention Jordy at Crass Trained is doing phenomenal things further up north. It may be pertinent to have those two gentleman get with the WIAA and see if any changes can be implemented.

not saying wisconsin will not be on the national level. I was directing my comments mainly toward what is happening on the high school level as concerns to what would make high school wrestling in wisconsin alittle bit better.

while I respect and admire what crass and awa has to offer and what they are doing, they probably will not have the ear of Dave Anderson or Wade Labecki. It is more the coach of any high school team that will have the ears of the WIAA.
Ben and AWA are far and away the best club in Wisconsin. They have multiple locations so they are meeting with more kids. They also are doing something no other club in the state is doing and that is helping people hundreds of miles away. You donít see Crass doing technique, and donít see Advance talking and doing Mental Mondays. High school coaches can have a bigger impact that a club coach because they have 5 practices a week whereas a club coach has a couple, but AWA is helping the whole state not just there 45 mile radius.




I donít believe this was started to be about whoís club is the best! Little guy was giving ideas about how to improve High School Wrestling during the folkstyle season.
I personally like the idea of event or match count let the coaches decide whatís best for their team

Of course every parent thinks the club they support is the best otherwise we wouldnít be paying the fees for our children to attend that club.

Sorry I didn't mean to make it sound like that. I am just saying people think clubs are the answer but there are huge chunks of the state were there are no clubs, but AWA is finding a way to still impact them.
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« Reply #27 on: February 13, 2018, 10:26:49 AM »

Doc-You stating "one size does not fit all" is exactly my point in regards to cutting classes and co-ops.

The current weight classes are working for many schools.  Unfortunately it isn't for many.  Of those that it isn't-I would bet a mass majority of those schools have either 1) a long history (like last post stated) with minimal numbers or 2) their region of Wisconsin is historically low (ie-look at the metro Milwaukee regional numbers).

Again-before Co-ops and way, way, way before cutting weight classes I am for a concerted, organized marketing effort at local levels and thru-out the state.

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DocWrestling
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« Reply #28 on: February 13, 2018, 11:10:45 AM »

Sorry Doc, but I have to disagree about coops. Our experience between North Fond du Lac and St. Mary's Springs has been very positive. The Springs program was non-existent for over 10 years when we started the coop. For the first few years, we only had 2-4 kids from Springs. We are now up to 8 and they make up a little over a third of our team. We now can fill all 14 weight classes and have become a competitive team. Due to the success we have seen, our numbers are continuing to grow and the popularity of wrestling seems to be growing at both schools. I would say that we have successfully resurrected a program that was dead for over 10 years that at one time had been very successful.

I agree it is working well for you but you took on a school that had not had wrestling since the 1990's giving those kids an opportunity they never had. This added opportunities.   Springs will never add wrestling on their own again.  I am more worried about losing programs to co-ops today.  Springs program was lost 20+ years ago but I am quite happy those kids are getting a chance to wrestle especially after asking Fondy for years if we could include them in our program.  The other positive is that the schools are only a couple miles apart.  In these instances co-ops can work.  But in the rural world when schools are 15 miles away it does not work nearly as well.  Metro areas can make co-ops work much better and could be an option.  I am more concerned about losing all the small rural programs.  These kids rely on the local high school programs because getting to other high schools or private clubs are much more difficult for families to make work.  I fear some counties are going to have to go to one sports team for the whole county as rural population shrinks
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« Reply #28 on: February 13, 2018, 11:10:45 AM »

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MarkK
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« Reply #29 on: February 13, 2018, 11:20:16 AM »

I don't know if it has been said, but the conferences are a mess.  When you have to travel over 2 hours and pass literally dozens of schools to go to a conference dual that is broken.  You do not develop a rivalry with that.  You just ensure that the parents who can't get off work at 4 pm won't be able to make it.  It is academically unjustified and horrible.  It is not just wrestling, it is nearly every sport.   Then add the fact that our school is in 3 different conferences.   Oh boy, what a mess.  It is not in the best interest of the kids.  Then mix in the perpetual merry go round of the next conference you get assigned.   
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