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Author Topic: Pulling Spencer Lee’s Redshirt?  (Read 2122 times)
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bigG
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« Reply #15 on: January 09, 2018, 11:14:24 AM »

The only reason a bluechip recruit gets his redshirt status pulled is because his coach thinks he can win a national championship. There is no grey area on this. In Spencer Lee's case he will be a true contender at the NCAA's, just as the Penn State coaches thought Mark Hall was going to be last year.

In the last 5 years we have started to see some "Once in a lifetime type wrestlers" come out of the US. Snyder, Hall, Lee, and Fix are just the beginning. When coaches are able to land these types of wrestlers, and only have a average option at best in that spot, they will call them up.

I'll be nice about this, Razor. No grey area? I'd beg to differ. Ooooodles of examples exist of pulling the RS to help the team out. No chance of a national title, the team had an injury and needed the RS to step up. Other reasons exist beyond the "you got a shot to win the big one, kid."

We have seen some amazing athletes do just as you said. Superstars. Many other redshirts get pulled for reasons other than the hopes, and realistic potential of winning, a national championship.

Reminds me of the student who protects their A's to the point of risking missing out on growth because the grades are more important than the growth. Seems to be a philosophical position that, sooner or later, bites the believer in the tail.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2018, 11:23:12 AM by bigG » Logged

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Barou
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« Reply #16 on: January 09, 2018, 01:16:01 PM »

The only reason a bluechip recruit gets his redshirt status pulled is because his coach thinks he can win a national championship. There is no grey area on this. In Spencer Lee's case he will be a true contender at the NCAA's, just as the Penn State coaches thought Mark Hall was going to be last year.

In the last 5 years we have started to see some "Once in a lifetime type wrestlers" come out of the US. Snyder, Hall, Lee, and Fix are just the beginning. When coaches are able to land these types of wrestlers, and only have a average option at best in that spot, they will call them up.

I'll be nice about this, Razor. No grey area? I'd beg to differ. Ooooodles of examples exist of pulling the RS to help the team out. No chance of a national title, the team had an injury and needed the RS to step up. Other reasons exist beyond the "you got a shot to win the big one, kid."

We have seen some amazing athletes do just as you said. Superstars. Many other redshirts get pulled for reasons other than the hopes, and realistic potential of winning, a national championship.

Reminds me of the student who protects their A's to the point of risking missing out on growth because the grades are more important than the growth. Seems to be a philosophical position that, sooner or later, bites the believer in the tail.

Did Barry pull Jimenez's red-shirt his freshman year thinking national title?
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wrastle63
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« Reply #17 on: January 09, 2018, 01:35:53 PM »

The only reason a bluechip recruit gets his redshirt status pulled is because his coach thinks he can win a national championship. There is no grey area on this. In Spencer Lee's case he will be a true contender at the NCAA's, just as the Penn State coaches thought Mark Hall was going to be last year.

In the last 5 years we have started to see some "Once in a lifetime type wrestlers" come out of the US. Snyder, Hall, Lee, and Fix are just the beginning. When coaches are able to land these types of wrestlers, and only have a average option at best in that spot, they will call them up.

I'll be nice about this, Razor. No grey area? I'd beg to differ. Ooooodles of examples exist of pulling the RS to help the team out. No chance of a national title, the team had an injury and needed the RS to step up. Other reasons exist beyond the "you got a shot to win the big one, kid."

We have seen some amazing athletes do just as you said. Superstars. Many other redshirts get pulled for reasons other than the hopes, and realistic potential of winning, a national championship.

Reminds me of the student who protects their A's to the point of risking missing out on growth because the grades are more important than the growth. Seems to be a philosophical position that, sooner or later, bites the believer in the tail.

Did Barry pull Jimenez's red-shirt his freshman year thinking national title?
Perfect example. They pulled it because it would make the team better and it did.
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Barou
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« Reply #18 on: January 09, 2018, 02:07:24 PM »

The only reason a bluechip recruit gets his redshirt status pulled is because his coach thinks he can win a national championship. There is no grey area on this. In Spencer Lee's case he will be a true contender at the NCAA's, just as the Penn State coaches thought Mark Hall was going to be last year.

In the last 5 years we have started to see some "Once in a lifetime type wrestlers" come out of the US. Snyder, Hall, Lee, and Fix are just the beginning. When coaches are able to land these types of wrestlers, and only have a average option at best in that spot, they will call them up.

I'll be nice about this, Razor. No grey area? I'd beg to differ. Ooooodles of examples exist of pulling the RS to help the team out. No chance of a national title, the team had an injury and needed the RS to step up. Other reasons exist beyond the "you got a shot to win the big one, kid."

We have seen some amazing athletes do just as you said. Superstars. Many other redshirts get pulled for reasons other than the hopes, and realistic potential of winning, a national championship.

Reminds me of the student who protects their A's to the point of risking missing out on growth because the grades are more important than the growth. Seems to be a philosophical position that, sooner or later, bites the believer in the tail.

Did Barry pull Jimenez's red-shirt his freshman year thinking national title?
Perfect example. They pulled it because it would make the team better and it did.

Not for nationals.
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wrastle63
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« Reply #19 on: January 09, 2018, 02:44:46 PM »

The only reason a bluechip recruit gets his redshirt status pulled is because his coach thinks he can win a national championship. There is no grey area on this. In Spencer Lee's case he will be a true contender at the NCAA's, just as the Penn State coaches thought Mark Hall was going to be last year.

In the last 5 years we have started to see some "Once in a lifetime type wrestlers" come out of the US. Snyder, Hall, Lee, and Fix are just the beginning. When coaches are able to land these types of wrestlers, and only have a average option at best in that spot, they will call them up.

I'll be nice about this, Razor. No grey area? I'd beg to differ. Ooooodles of examples exist of pulling the RS to help the team out. No chance of a national title, the team had an injury and needed the RS to step up. Other reasons exist beyond the "you got a shot to win the big one, kid."

We have seen some amazing athletes do just as you said. Superstars. Many other redshirts get pulled for reasons other than the hopes, and realistic potential of winning, a national championship.

Reminds me of the student who protects their A's to the point of risking missing out on growth because the grades are more important than the growth. Seems to be a philosophical position that, sooner or later, bites the believer in the tail.

Did Barry pull Jimenez's red-shirt his freshman year thinking national title?
Perfect example. They pulled it because it would make the team better and it did.

Not for nationals.
Yea he did really bad....he lost to Tomasello 7-2 and to Lambert 4-0. Tomasello won the bracket and Lambert took 6th.
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« Reply #19 on: January 09, 2018, 02:44:46 PM »

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bigG
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« Reply #20 on: January 09, 2018, 02:56:09 PM »

Every team/coach does it, though.

JJ did kind of hurt us in the end. Redshirt stripping has upsides (Snyder and Hall) and downsides. Now, if the guys is good enough, you have to think NCAAs, Olys and worlds. Nice problem.
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Barou
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« Reply #21 on: January 09, 2018, 03:16:44 PM »

The only reason a bluechip recruit gets his redshirt status pulled is because his coach thinks he can win a national championship. There is no grey area on this. In Spencer Lee's case he will be a true contender at the NCAA's, just as the Penn State coaches thought Mark Hall was going to be last year.

In the last 5 years we have started to see some "Once in a lifetime type wrestlers" come out of the US. Snyder, Hall, Lee, and Fix are just the beginning. When coaches are able to land these types of wrestlers, and only have a average option at best in that spot, they will call them up.

I'll be nice about this, Razor. No grey area? I'd beg to differ. Ooooodles of examples exist of pulling the RS to help the team out. No chance of a national title, the team had an injury and needed the RS to step up. Other reasons exist beyond the "you got a shot to win the big one, kid."

We have seen some amazing athletes do just as you said. Superstars. Many other redshirts get pulled for reasons other than the hopes, and realistic potential of winning, a national championship.

Reminds me of the student who protects their A's to the point of risking missing out on growth because the grades are more important than the growth. Seems to be a philosophical position that, sooner or later, bites the believer in the tail.

Did Barry pull Jimenez's red-shirt his freshman year thinking national title?
Perfect example. They pulled it because it would make the team better and it did.

Not for nationals.
Yea he did really bad....he lost to Tomasello 7-2 and to Lambert 4-0. Tomasello won the bracket and Lambert took 6th.

Seriously, that's what you got out of that?  Who said he did "really bad" at the Big Ten tournament?  Some might think pulling a RS off a true Freshman would make sense if you had a sure fire qualifier.  Do you think pulling JJ's RS late in the season was a good idea?  He finished 5 - 9. 
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bigG
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« Reply #22 on: January 09, 2018, 03:49:39 PM »

I get the logic; but (with the bennie of hindshit) think it turned out not-as-good.
Losing to Tomasello 7-2 almost sounds apologetic. Tomasello was/is many miles ahead of JJ.

JJ didn't do really bad. Didn't really kick tail, either. Kind of tepid... for a threat to win his weight in the NCAAs.
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Razor Ramon
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« Reply #23 on: January 09, 2018, 04:50:22 PM »

The only reason a bluechip recruit gets his redshirt status pulled is because his coach thinks he can win a national championship. There is no grey area on this. In Spencer Lee's case he will be a true contender at the NCAA's, just as the Penn State coaches thought Mark Hall was going to be last year.

In the last 5 years we have started to see some "Once in a lifetime type wrestlers" come out of the US. Snyder, Hall, Lee, and Fix are just the beginning. When coaches are able to land these types of wrestlers, and only have a average option at best in that spot, they will call them up.

I'll be nice about this, Razor. No grey area? I'd beg to differ. Ooooodles of examples exist of pulling the RS to help the team out. No chance of a national title, the team had an injury and needed the RS to step up. Other reasons exist beyond the "you got a shot to win the big one, kid."

We have seen some amazing athletes do just as you said. Superstars. Many other redshirts get pulled for reasons other than the hopes, and realistic potential of winning, a national championship.

Reminds me of the student who protects their A's to the point of risking missing out on growth because the grades are more important than the growth. Seems to be a philosophical position that, sooner or later, bites the believer in the tail.

I'll be even nicer, bigG. I was referring to BLUECHIPS that get their RS pulled. You are referring to the countless number of mid-level wrestlers that get put in the lineup. Not even close to the same thing. Stay on topic.
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« Reply #24 on: January 09, 2018, 10:30:24 PM »

Johnny Jimenez' RS should never have been pulled.
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« Reply #24 on: January 09, 2018, 10:30:24 PM »

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billymurphy
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« Reply #25 on: January 10, 2018, 11:39:48 AM »

Jimenez was never going to be an All American (at least not at Wisconsin).

In hindsight, pulling the redshirt was not the best decision.
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mkm13
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« Reply #26 on: January 10, 2018, 11:49:41 AM »

Johnny Jimenez' RS should never have been pulled.

Why?  To give him the 5th year so he can go from a low end qualifier in year 4 to an AA candidate in his last year?  How many guys do that?   Does he want to be in school for 5 years?

 
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Ivan Stankowski
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« Reply #27 on: January 10, 2018, 11:53:02 AM »

If he graduates from the UW in 4 years while wrestling all 4 years that would some accomplishment in itself
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Wisconsin Wrestling Fan
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« Reply #28 on: January 10, 2018, 12:15:56 PM »

Johnny Jimenez' RS should never have been pulled.

Why?  To give him the 5th year so he can go from a low end qualifier in year 4 to an AA candidate in his last year?  How many guys do that?   Does he want to be in school for 5 years?

 

Ron Jeidy was a National Champ as a 5th Year Senior.
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« Reply #28 on: January 10, 2018, 12:15:56 PM »

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Jimmy
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« Reply #29 on: January 10, 2018, 01:53:47 PM »

Jesse Witmer was a 5 th yr. sr. national champ having been second string the three yrs prior
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